Rebuild the 13B, best advice anyone will give you here.

 

$10k is actually on the very low end of the price range. They get up to $15k pretty fast.

 

10k prolly won't cut it.

I'd be a little leary of keeping the TIIs tranny in there.

You'd be much better off rebuilding the 13b (or just getting a new one - 3k-4k) and upgrading the turbo, apex seals, and radiator. It won't have as much potential as a the 20b but it will be a hell of a lot easier.

If you do it though (20b swap)...I wanna see it.

 

I did some competitive price searching for the parts I needed and found I could get it to around $5500 if I looked in the right places. That would mean though that I would have to install this without professional paid-for labor.
As for my Turbo II tranny: it will be fine. All Cosmo 20Bs were automatic anyways, so it's not like I can find a manual made for it unless I pay some money out the ass... The Turbo II tranny is in no way simlilar to the N/A tranny. I think I remember reading that my tranny can handle 400hp no prob.
But I have never read during my research of a 20B swap that I should get another tranny, it just says I keep the Turbo II one.

Here's the list:
20B $3500
Oil cooler lines (longer) $100
Cosmo ECU $50
Cosmo Wiring Harness $150
Engine Mounts $200
Upgraded radiator $500
Front mount plus piping $500 (ebay it)
Lightweight flywheel $500
Misc. hoses $100

I need to post this link I found on FC3S.org about the 20B swap when I get the chance and find it again.

 

Upgrading the apex seals are highly overrated. They don't really do crap to get those ceramic apex seals... and you should look at the price for those things. Look it up, and you'll see that getting a 20B would be better than doing that considering the money per horsepower gain. Also when you have ceramic apex seals, when do go in your engine, your rotor & rotor housing is ruined.

EDIT: Also my radiator has already been upgraded and turbo too on the 13B. I might go with another 13B and have it ported again... who knows, I might hold off on the 20B because I know for fact that around 3K I can get a ported 13B back in my Turbo II. The Turbo II was pushing somewhere around 300 when it went I want it dyno'd as soon as I get another ported 13B or the 20B in it. I could hold off for a year like for the summer of '06 to get a 20B. Who knows... but if I get another 13BT i will post my dyno and some pics.

 

The only reason to upgrade the seals to a 2 part seal is to increase the boost without destroying the motor. The seals don't do squat to add power themselves. There is still some debate on whether or not the apex seal upgrades are required to add more boost but they certainly are a good preventative measure when adding more boost. The seals should be expensive since you need to tear down the motor to get to them...while you're in there you can also swap the rotors (if you are looking for a different compression or lighter weight).

I really think the 20bs are cool but unless you really need a 900hp car...

 

Yeah, sorry I worded it bad. I know the apex seals don't add horsepower, I meant the actual singnificance horsepower it allows you to pertain. I have heard tons of arguments of apex seals all the time. I truthfully don't know who to believe sometimes because there is always a good point somewhere. That's the problem... if rotaries were as popular as piston engines, we would have all these facts straight, but for now rotary people have to learn to work with a largely uneducated amount of people about rotary engines. I really really want to do the 20B swap so bad!!! BUT, I think I should wait. In looking at it all, the 13B has more potential (at least in the US). Upgrading the 20B will probably be way too expensive... and knowing myself I can't be happy with what I got for anymore than a year than without having to add something else significant... so, I suppose for my style with cars, I should stay with the 13B... Maybe I'll use my brother's FC (haha, we're the rotary brothers like form Initial D) since he doesn't want it anymore, and I'll make that a side project in the future for myself (if I can afford keeping an Eagle Talon on the road, my Turbo II, and funding a 20B project at the time.

All I can do is hope... and dream. But back to reality: I'm just gonna swap my 13BT with another 13BT and have it ported. I found one that can be delievered to my house $1130. I think that's a damn good price - I'll need another G to have someone port it. I'll probably drop it in myself. so less than $2500 to get my car running like new again isnt bad.

 

Yeah the seal thing really seems to depend on tuning and luck. There are many people that have added boost to the FD and had no problem running stock seals while others have detonated engines. It doesn't help that some of the 13bs can be killed by one ping and others can ping a few times w/o problems. Thankfully the Renesis seems to be stronger in that regard (Mazda seems to be learning). The 13b should be able to put out 500 hp, granted, it won't last 100,000 miles with that setup but it is possible. 300 hp should be pretty easy to get from a 13b.

The 20b is an awesome power plant, but like I said unless you need 900hp.

 

i wouldn't see myself ever exceeding 500hp on a 13B setup, after all if i was that power hungry, i wouldn't hesitate to swap for a 20B. i was running 300hp on the set-up i have now. I'd like 375.

As for the Renesis, I have heard skepticisms about that, but the Renesis hasnt been around long enough to get real definitive answers. I takes at least 5 years to get a good idea on everything.

I have a question anyways, do you think you know anyone who would know how to get 350hp from an all motor 13B, cuz in reality i'd rather have that than turbo it to 350. I know if i take off my turbo with my setup i might have like 200hp. I really like to drag, but also like learning to drift and I have noticed that the n/a rx7s are so much better for drifting. I've been able to compare since i drive my bro's n/a sometimes and i realize a difference into the entrance and exit on the turn. I wish there was like a switch you could make that would lock up the turbo from spooling when you didn't want it to kick in. is there anything out there that could significantly prevent it from spooling without causing damage or having me constantly popping the hood and fiddlin around in the engine bay?

 

350 hp from an N/A 13b...I don't really think it's possible. If you could increase the displacement it would be possible. If you set up a boost controller and had two different maps for your ECU you should be able to switch between a high boost and low boost setting fairly easily (still not ideal for drifting though). You said your brother had a 7 he doesn't want...I'd just take one of the 7s and set it up N/A for drifting and set the other one up for drag (that would be easier). The 20b would be able to make power like that N/A but I'm not sure if the weight would upset the handling. You should run a search on the rx7club.com forums and see what the limit of the 13b N/A is.

Charles Hill has pinged his Renesis alot while adding NO2. The 55 shot worked fine but he was getting pings with the 75 shot and up. I was at a dyno session last Friday with two FEs running 7 lbs of boost and the engine seemed perfectly happy with that low level of boost (time will tell). I'm hoping the Ren can make 350 hp with 12-15 psi.