let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
Registered Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 199
Likes: 0
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
Comparing the s4's spool response isn't fair!! No wonder you consider 4k laggy. 4k full spool and 700whp capable is a fair trade off in my book. My talon was never really laggy feeling to me either, I just re-learned how to keep the revs right and boost came on instantly, no down low power though. At the "700whp" power level though, the supporting mods will be substantial and the car will probably be on AEM or equivalent tuning, large cams, dual fuel pumps, etc etc.
You are right though, I want to keep the car very driveable/streetable and not take away from it's luxuries. SRT racing (swift racing technologies) are pretty well known for building fast IS's. I might give them a call and see what their take would be on a 500whp pump gas car and see what negatives might come with it.
I thought about keeping all the turbo stuff all the talon, and moving it over to an Is300 but it was impossible to find one nearby so I figured parting it was the best idea. Had I of kept a good portion of the universal stuff, I wouldn't have to buy much.
Anyways, theres another thread for all that.
My talon should be back together within a week or two.
You are right though, I want to keep the car very driveable/streetable and not take away from it's luxuries. SRT racing (swift racing technologies) are pretty well known for building fast IS's. I might give them a call and see what their take would be on a 500whp pump gas car and see what negatives might come with it.
I thought about keeping all the turbo stuff all the talon, and moving it over to an Is300 but it was impossible to find one nearby so I figured parting it was the best idea. Had I of kept a good portion of the universal stuff, I wouldn't have to buy much.
Anyways, theres another thread for all that.
My talon should be back together within a week or two.
wub wub wub wub
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 19,724
Likes: 0
From: Virginia
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
Forgive me if this is a stupid question but, For these cars (supra's, dsm's, or imports in general) can you change your gearing? If you put in a higher gear, the motor would load up the turbos sooner and you would have full boost at a lower rpm. Don't really know if this is applicapble.
Registered Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 199
Likes: 0
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
For the record, i have never owned or driven a 4cly. or 6cly with a lerge turbo. So it is very possible that I'm an idiot.
wub wub wub wub
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 19,724
Likes: 0
From: Virginia
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
ok cool. I've never understood the lag issue. Only lag you should have is at the track in first gear if you dont have two-step or auto or something like that. On the street brake boost the bitch.
For the record, i have never owned or driven a 4cly. or 6cly with a lerge turbo. So it is very possible that I'm an idiot.
For the record, i have never owned or driven a 4cly. or 6cly with a lerge turbo. So it is very possible that I'm an idiot.
I <3 2JZ
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,004
Likes: 0
From: Roanoke, VA
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
At the strip, a laggy turbo isn't nearly as much of a problem as more than likely your launching off a 2-step / anti-lag. If the turbo is fairly large, re-spool time (transient boost) in between gears may take a bit longer hindering your et time. Dsmlink and many standalones can enable anti-lag in between gears to help this out. A BB turbo cartridge is known for improving transient spool times more so than quicker spool all together.
On the street with a laggier turbo setup, you have to kinda be in the right spot on the rpm band to get a quick spool, around 4k+. If not there is always brake boosting but I view that as a last minute resort. Usually when racing anything in the talon, the other guy would get a good torque jump on me and then I'd come rolling past like his brakes were on.
The 20g was the most fun turbo on the street that I ever owned. With the 2.0L, 2nd gear rolling WOT would hit 3600-3700 @ 23psi and it felt so torquey. The mitsu hotside was alot smaller than any t3 turbine and the compressor housing was small as well / including obviously the compressor wheel.
On the street with a laggier turbo setup, you have to kinda be in the right spot on the rpm band to get a quick spool, around 4k+. If not there is always brake boosting but I view that as a last minute resort. Usually when racing anything in the talon, the other guy would get a good torque jump on me and then I'd come rolling past like his brakes were on.
The 20g was the most fun turbo on the street that I ever owned. With the 2.0L, 2nd gear rolling WOT would hit 3600-3700 @ 23psi and it felt so torquey. The mitsu hotside was alot smaller than any t3 turbine and the compressor housing was small as well / including obviously the compressor wheel.
Registered Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 199
Likes: 0
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
I definitely wouldn't go so far as to call you an idiot, because it seems a lot easier "on paper" in the black and white to not have lag... IMO, if you have a BIG turbo that doesn't spool until at least 4000 rpm's or higher, brake boosting isn't always a possibility. Gearing could help, but I don't think there's really a good way to effectively eliminate lag completely on the street. I mean, I've heard of some people using nitrous to sort of fill the void, and then some people do twinchargers where it's supercharged and turbo'd. Gearing seemed to help for me, but it wouldn't eliminate lag altogether.
❒Good ❒ Better ✔Best
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 4,598
Likes: 0
From: Fredericksburg
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
never understood why people have so much trouble understanding the physics of twins vs single. twins hardly spool faster. You get the same or better flow from a single with less or the same lag. It takes exhaust to spool a turbo, if you're spooling two, then each takes half the exhaust. So the trade of spool for power is always the same. Single is cheaper, simpler, lighter, and just easier all around to deal with, and in most cases just as or more effective.
Show-lo car
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,493
Likes: 0
From: NC/WA
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
1-2gen DSMer's! i have a new unused WeaponR (blue) V2 air filter still in original plastic. drops in for use with OEM can or just clamp it on w/o the can. $15+ shipping its yours.
Registered Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,520
Likes: 0
From: Fredericksburg/Blacksburg, VA
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
My take on a twin turbo sytem, and this would be more from an engineering perspective, is that if you have a given diameter wheel, you have a given moment of inertia for that wheel as well as a given center cartridge negative torque. When you use a twin turbo system, you can reduce the moment of inertia, but there are inherent losses from splitting the exhaust flow, an doubling the negative torque required to spin the center cartridges. A sequential setup allows a smaller lower intertia turbo to spool first and then have the added flow of a second turbo laterl on, but a true twin setup is a failboat IMO.
I believe dave is looking for a nice Weapon R intake for his 1g talon AWD
.
I believe dave is looking for a nice Weapon R intake for his 1g talon AWD
.
❒Good ❒ Better ✔Best
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 4,598
Likes: 0
From: Fredericksburg
Re: let make a car specific thread(dsmers)
Forgive me if this is a stupid question but, For these cars (supra's, dsm's, or imports in general) can you change your gearing? If you put in a higher gear, the motor would load up the turbos sooner and you would have full boost at a lower rpm. Don't really know if this is applicapble.
Doesn't really work like that. Yes it would load up the motor earlier, thus reducing RPM lag, but it would cause an increase in transient lag, which is much worse. If you're used to 5 speed turbo cars you never really realize how much you're losing on shifts. Look at some EMS logs of boost on a 5 speed vs auto car and you see a whole new world of RPM at the beginning of each gearshift
Anti-lag and no-lift help a lot but still can't keep the boost up like an auto.